login   |    register
Armor/AFV: Allied - WWII
Armor and ground forces of the Allied forces during World War II.
Hosted by Darren Baker
Sherman M4A3E2 Jumbo
Sabot
Joined: December 18, 2001
KitMaker: 12,596 posts
AeroScale: 287 posts
Posted: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 - 11:53 AM UTC
What's needed to make a decent Jumbo? I have the old Tamiya kit that I built OOB when it first came out back in 1987-88. I was going to rebuild it using the Tank Workshop turret, but since I recently got a new Tamiya Jumbo and I want to start fresh. I know that the use of the spoked Italeri roadwheels are recommended. How about the Tamiya hull with the kit armor add ons? Is this good enough or is a resin hull required? BTW, I do know that the Tamiya hull sponsons need to be blanked off. What tracks should I get too?
GunTruck
_VISITCOMMUNITY
California, United States
Joined: December 01, 2001
KitMaker: 5,885 posts
AeroScale: 103 posts
Posted: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 - 12:06 PM UTC
I was pondering that same question. I went to Blast Modelssite in France and checked their impending release out. I think I might just purchase that one instead of the "scavenger hunt" approach. Blast Models' quality is first-rate, well worth waiting for...

If PenPen reads this thread - perhaps he can chime in - might have even seen the real item in the store over there...

Gunnie
Kencelot
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Florida, United States
Joined: December 27, 2001
KitMaker: 4,268 posts
AeroScale: 0 posts
Posted: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 - 01:00 PM UTC
Hey Rob, I've been collecting the various extras needed to correct the kit according to Jeff Brooks' article over at ML's site. M4A3E2 Sherman Jumbo
Although the build pics are no longer there the read is.

I like Gunnie's idea with the Blast kit! It's that horrible noise of cha-ching that keeps me with the former.
Sabot
Joined: December 18, 2001
KitMaker: 12,596 posts
AeroScale: 287 posts
Posted: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 - 03:25 PM UTC
Agreed Ken, Blast one sounds nice, but I figured I would be able to piece together a fairly decent one with the TWS turret and barrel, Tamiya hull and someone's running gear/tracks. I'm not adverse to doing a little work on the hull. The article will be a good start for me.
shermanfreak
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Alberta, Canada
Joined: January 24, 2003
KitMaker: 380 posts
AeroScale: 0 posts
Posted: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 - 03:36 PM UTC
Rob,
From everything that I heard about the Jumbo...the biggest problems are the turret and the transmission housing. Both of these are available from TW and I purchased them about 6 years ago...they are not bad, not bad at all. As far as the rest of the Jumbo kit goes I used it to build mine, close up the sponsons and model on. The tracks that come with the kit have the extended end connectors which were on all Jumbos.
Hope I've helped a bit.
Kelley
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Georgia, United States
Joined: November 21, 2002
KitMaker: 1,966 posts
AeroScale: 0 posts
Posted: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 - 03:38 PM UTC
Rob,
Here is a link to a thread over on ML you might be interested in. The person gives a quick in box review of the Blast Jumbo(which sounds really nice) he also said he has a few Tank Workshop spares, hulls, turrett etc. for the Jumbo he would be willing to part with.

HTH
Mike


http://www.network54.com/Hide/Forum/thread?forumid=47208&messageid=1046187118
Bravo21
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Washington, United States
Joined: February 07, 2003
KitMaker: 78 posts
AeroScale: 0 posts
Posted: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 - 09:18 PM UTC
Rob,

I built the Tamiya Jumbo back in the mid 90's and corrected it without the convenience of Tank Workshop parts. I was stationed in Germany at the time (Vilsek, west side of the Graf gunnery complex) and we had a Jumbo on display in our battalion park. I took a number of photos of the tank and a few measurements of the transmission cover. I had some additional pictures and measurements of the turret as well, but I've misplaced them in the 4 relocations I've made since then. Anyway, I'm going to build another Tamiya Jumbo and have the TW turret and tranny cover to go with it. I think the TW tranny cover needs to be beefed up just a tad. If you like, I can scan my pictures and the rough measurements of the tranny cover and send them to you for additional reference. If you want them, let me know.

Other than that, the kit's hull is fine. Your plan to fill the sponsons and replace the roadwheels and possibly the tracks is about all you need. TW also makes stamped-spoke and solid wheels. The kit's VVSS units need the usual bolts heads and bolt holes but they are otherwise fine. Modelkasten and AFV Club make individual link Sherman track sets with the extended end connectors you'll want. The AFV Club tracks are pretty nice and about 1/3 the price of the Modelkasten tracks.

Dave Clark
ex-US Army CPT (AR)
Sabot
Joined: December 18, 2001
KitMaker: 12,596 posts
AeroScale: 287 posts
Posted: Thursday, February 27, 2003 - 12:24 AM UTC
Vilsek, brings back memories of M1A1 transition training and M1A1 Heavy rollover training. I contacted Marc (the guy Mike mentions) and I'm getting his TWS hull and tranny for $6+2.50 s/h.

I'll take any info you may have on the vehicle's tranny cover. I took a look at the TWS turret and barrel so I'll use those straight.
generalzod
_VISITCOMMUNITY
United States
Joined: December 01, 2001
KitMaker: 3,172 posts
AeroScale: 0 posts
Posted: Thursday, February 27, 2003 - 02:00 AM UTC
Rob,if you use the AFV Club T48 rubber chevron links be warned You need to buy to packs to have enough of the extended end connectors to put on all the links You only get 120 of the duck bills per box But still it's cheaper than one Model Kasten box
Sabot
Joined: December 18, 2001
KitMaker: 12,596 posts
AeroScale: 287 posts
Posted: Thursday, February 27, 2003 - 02:56 AM UTC
Thanks for the head's up Chad.

Anyone know if the Eduard PE set (#35402) for the Tamiya kit is worth the bucks?
penpen
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Hauts-de-Seine, France
Joined: April 11, 2002
KitMaker: 1,757 posts
AeroScale: 0 posts
Posted: Thursday, February 27, 2003 - 03:16 AM UTC
Hello Rob !

To be honest, I must say that I'm a great afficionados of Blast-Models.
I saw the built kit in their shop and I must say that it's a beauty.
The price may seem a bit steap, but compared to the price of a tamiya kit + Eduard PE + AFV tracks + whatever else... the price is good !
Also, you'll have better detail.

I didn't buy this kit but I've got the Borgwald, still unbuilt, and what they do is great quality. I'm getting all excited about their future releases : Tiran 5 conversion, and 20mm turret for VAB...

Also : I have absolutely no participation in their buisiness ! Simply, they are a great bunch of people who love armor and models and work hard to bring us quality products !
Bravo21
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Washington, United States
Joined: February 07, 2003
KitMaker: 78 posts
AeroScale: 0 posts
Posted: Thursday, February 27, 2003 - 06:33 AM UTC
Rob,

Give me few days and I'll e-mail the pics and info to you directly. Then I'll figure out how to submit them to the gallery section for everyone to see.

Dave
keenan
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Indiana, United States
Joined: October 16, 2002
KitMaker: 5,272 posts
AeroScale: 74 posts
Posted: Thursday, February 27, 2003 - 08:13 AM UTC
Reading this thread I guess this thing isn't worth building OOB? I'm sitting here looking at mine wondering if I should just pitch it out the window or get a second job to pay for all the aftermarket crap.

GunTruck
_VISITCOMMUNITY
California, United States
Joined: December 01, 2001
KitMaker: 5,885 posts
AeroScale: 103 posts
Posted: Thursday, February 27, 2003 - 08:39 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Reading this thread I guess this thing isn't worth building OOB? I'm sitting here looking at mine wondering if I should just pitch it out the window or get a second job to pay for all the aftermarket crap.




I thought it was worth building it OOB - but Sherman-Fans get pretty intense about these vehicles. I figured, if anything, I could learn the finer points - regardless whether or not I decide to model any of them

Gunnie
Sabot
Joined: December 18, 2001
KitMaker: 12,596 posts
AeroScale: 287 posts
Posted: Thursday, February 27, 2003 - 08:41 AM UTC
Actually, from what I understand, the kit hull is OK once you do the customary sponson blanking; the tranny can most likely be beefed up with Squadron putty; tracks & running gear are OK (not best, but OK). My OOB Jumbo looks like a Jumbo to me, but it's not something I would have entered in a contest (not that I enter contests any way). I wanted to do one right without sinking really big bucks into the kit. Most of my tweaks will come from the parts box (Italeri roadwheels), or bargin basement deals (TWS turret, barrel, hull, tranny=about $15), and then the tracks....don't know if I will spend the $20 for AFV Club tracks or not...most likely use the kit tracks. Too bad the Jumbo didn't use HVSS tracks, those sets are a dime a dozen out there.
Bravo21
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Washington, United States
Joined: February 07, 2003
KitMaker: 78 posts
AeroScale: 0 posts
Posted: Thursday, February 27, 2003 - 08:48 AM UTC
I don't think I'd pitch the kit just yet. The kit's biggest shortfalls are the turret and the nose (transmission cover). GreatModels Webstore lists the Tank Workshop turret at $12.95 (US) and the tranny cover as "out of production". I bet if you shop around a bit or watch the wants/disposals section of this site, Track-Link, Missing Links, etc. you can score a transmission cover for $4 or $5. VLS lists it as availble on their site for $7. The rest of the kit is very workable and you can build a pretty good looking Jumbo using the kit tracks and road wheels, thought the road wheels will have hollow backs. All depends on how much of an accuracy nut you are. I built my first Jumbo using the kit supplied wheels and tracks and it looks just fine sitting in my display case. It even won a 1st place at the '96 IPMS/USA National Convention. GreatModels also sells a Tank Workshop Jumbo Sherman Combo pack that contains the complete turret, nose, and solid road wheels for $21.60 (US).

If you want to build a Jumbo and already have the kit, it's not too much further to go to pick up the Tank Workshop stuff. :-)
generalzod
_VISITCOMMUNITY
United States
Joined: December 01, 2001
KitMaker: 3,172 posts
AeroScale: 0 posts
Posted: Thursday, February 27, 2003 - 08:50 AM UTC
Speaking of HVSS Rob,I'm actually thinking of building 2 Jumbo's with the HVSS One will have a 17lber and the other a 105mm howitzer The engines will be a Cat diesel 600 hp type
keenan
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Indiana, United States
Joined: October 16, 2002
KitMaker: 5,272 posts
AeroScale: 74 posts
Posted: Thursday, February 27, 2003 - 11:15 AM UTC
I was thinking about building it and putting it abandoned, stuck in a ditch for a Battle of the Bulge dio, with Dragons 101st airborne guys...
Sabot
Joined: December 18, 2001
KitMaker: 12,596 posts
AeroScale: 287 posts
Posted: Thursday, February 27, 2003 - 11:41 AM UTC
I agree with Bravo, it's still one of the better M4A3 hulls around. Add the Italeri turret and have fun.
jackhammer
_VISITCOMMUNITY
North Carolina, United States
Joined: November 12, 2002
KitMaker: 357 posts
AeroScale: 0 posts
Posted: Thursday, February 27, 2003 - 11:47 AM UTC
I have the Tamiya jumbo.Eduard PE set for the same(A must in my book), Custom Dioramic Dished wheels, Modelkasten Tracks, and the Elephant 75mm turned barrel. I have to aquire the TWS turret and tranny nose,which has been talked about indepth in the posts before. The only other thing I would suggest, and am still waiting for the re-issue of, is a set of AFV Club VVSS suspension. The suspension in the kit is just not compressed enough for the jumbo(so I have been told by the sherman experts everywhere).I am toying with the idea of doing the engine and interior(Yes...I know, it's a sickness of which I AM NOT looking for a cure).She is destined for the rear of a dragonwagon and don't think it would be opened up back there,but.....there are other lovelies that don't have interiors available that I could throw back there. All and all, the Tamiya Jumbo has the greatest base for severe detailing and Wallet wringing. My $.02 worth of knowledge.........completely drained now. Oh, Well!
keenan
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Indiana, United States
Joined: October 16, 2002
KitMaker: 5,272 posts
AeroScale: 74 posts
Posted: Thursday, February 27, 2003 - 11:53 AM UTC
Sounds like it would be cheaper to buy and restore a real one...
shermanfreak
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Alberta, Canada
Joined: January 24, 2003
KitMaker: 380 posts
AeroScale: 0 posts
Posted: Thursday, February 27, 2003 - 01:45 PM UTC
Here's a couple of shots of the TW turret and transmission housing...hope they help you out Rob.


Sabot
Joined: December 18, 2001
KitMaker: 12,596 posts
AeroScale: 287 posts
Posted: Thursday, February 27, 2003 - 02:01 PM UTC
Is that the 75mm gun on that tank?
shermanfreak
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Alberta, Canada
Joined: January 24, 2003
KitMaker: 380 posts
AeroScale: 0 posts
Posted: Thursday, February 27, 2003 - 02:05 PM UTC
Yes sir. All Jumbos were armed with the 75. A request to upgun to a 76 and then a 90 were never carried out.
SEDimmick
_VISITCOMMUNITY
New Jersey, United States
Joined: March 15, 2002
KitMaker: 1,745 posts
AeroScale: 20 posts
Posted: Thursday, February 27, 2003 - 04:20 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Yes sir. All Jumbos were armed with the 75. A request to upgun to a 76 and then a 90 were never carried out.



Not quite...there are several photos of the Jumbo armed with the 76mm gun. The 75 and 76mm had the same mount in the turret making it fairly easy to swap out the two.