login   |    register
Armor/AFV: Canadian Armor
Discuss all types of Canadian Armor of all eras.
Hosted by Darren Baker
me again. Help w/Shermans
Alberta, Canada
Joined: September 25, 2002
KitMaker: 501 posts
AeroScale: 0 posts
Posted: Monday, October 07, 2002 - 02:15 PM UTC
I need some help again. I figure I'll ask the know it all's instead of spending countless hours searching on the net (and thus pissing off my wife :-) )
What I'm looking for is which Shermans Canadians used in the ETO. I've seen pics of Fireflys and also ones with the 75/76? barrel. We used the HVSS supension right? Also what type of track did we use? I think thats all, if not I know where to ask. :-)
Joined: December 18, 2001
KitMaker: 12,596 posts
AeroScale: 287 posts
Posted: Monday, October 07, 2002 - 02:27 PM UTC
Most tanks used by our allies used the VVSS (vertical volute suspension system) and not the HVSS. The HVSS was a rather late upgrade and seen mostly on M4A3 tanks. I believe the Canadians used the M4, M4A1, M4A2 and M4A4. They probably used the M4A3 since it was the most prolific Sherman variant produced.

The M4A1 also received the HVSS, but there is debate as to whether or not the variant served in combat. I don't know the answer, but I know that when I was in Germany, we had an M4A1E8 in front of my company armed with a 76mm gun complete with muzzle brake.
Florida, United States
Joined: December 27, 2001
KitMaker: 4,268 posts
AeroScale: 0 posts
Posted: Monday, October 07, 2002 - 02:46 PM UTC
I do not know too much about the Sherman in Canadian service other than the M4A1's they received. As far as the track types, most were fitted (not all) with what were a very interesting type called "Canadian Dry Pin". They were cast manganese steel links. An interesting feature was the use of a seventeen toothed sprocket. Here's a good picture of the tracks:

Here's a few nice pics of the "Grizzly"
Joined: May 31, 2002
KitMaker: 1,109 posts
AeroScale: 0 posts
Posted: Monday, October 07, 2002 - 03:37 PM UTC
I just came across this excellent resource. Should be useful no matter what Sherman you are building.

Sherman Specifics

In another thread, I mentioned that I am building a Canadian M4A4 (Sherman V) of the Three Rivers' Regiment at Ortona during Christmas of 1943. For this, I elected to go with Dragon's Sherman Vc Firefly (#6121) even though I needed a short-barrelled 75-mm gun. The reason I did this is because the DML M4A4s that do have the short gun for some reason have a different return roller set-up, which is apparently wrong. To convert the Firefly into a regular Sherman V, I need to replace the gun and mantlet with a Tank Workshop item and fill in the left hatch on the turret. Of course, there are a number of other little things to do, but those are the major changes necessary. I don't profess to be an expert on Shermans, though. All this stuff I learned here on Armorama.

Alberta, Canada
Joined: September 25, 2002
KitMaker: 501 posts
AeroScale: 0 posts
Posted: Monday, October 07, 2002 - 04:32 PM UTC
Thanks alot guys I knew you'd be a big help.
Joined: March 18, 2002
KitMaker: 181 posts
AeroScale: 0 posts
Posted: Monday, October 07, 2002 - 06:17 PM UTC
Could I suggest that these sites may be of some help:

The Canadian Armoured Corps in the Second World War
Nothing specific on the Sherman, but some other useful stuff such as markings, honours, organisation and casulties.

Like it says, miscillanous stuff on the Canadian Army during WW2, some of it again may be helpful.

The Sherman Register, specifically Canada's Section

Canadian Tracks has a section on the M4

Joined: March 06, 2002
KitMaker: 939 posts
AeroScale: 0 posts
Posted: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 - 01:49 AM UTC
You've gotten lots of good stuff.

The Canadian Dry pin track was used more on Rams and Ram Kangaroos. Most photos I've seen show Canadian Shermans to be outfitted similarly to British Shermans, although with more kit on them!

The M4A3 was not used in combat in WW2.

M4A3E8 Shermans were used by Canadians in Korea.

The links suggested above are my main source of information, along with the little bit of coverage in books. I believe the Sherman V (M4A4) was the most common variant used in Normandy onwards, with either the 75mm gun or as a Firefly, with the 17 pounder. The DML kit #6121 is the best representation of a Canadian North West ETO tank. I think Sherman I, II and III were more common in use in Italy.