login   |    register
Armor/AFV: Axis - WWII
Armor and ground forces of the Axis forces during World War II.
Hosted by Darren Baker
Post-war use of German vehicles ...
pbennett
_VISITCOMMUNITY
United Kingdom
Joined: October 14, 2007
KitMaker: 464 posts
AeroScale: 15 posts
Posted: Monday, October 12, 2020 - 11:21 PM UTC
I am aware that certain Allied vehicles were later used by civilian haulage companies in the UK (Diamond T and Scammell being two examples). Is there any evidence of German vehicles being similarly used in Europe? I was thinking in particular of the FAMO and other half-track prime movers (or indeed, any other load carrying vehicles).
barkingdigger
Staff MemberAssociate Editor
ARMORAMA
#013
_VISITCOMMUNITY
England - East Anglia, United Kingdom
Joined: June 20, 2008
KitMaker: 3,976 posts
AeroScale: 4 posts
Posted: Monday, October 12, 2020 - 11:26 PM UTC
Not sure about tracked things, but I suspect plenty of wheeled trucks were recycled post-war. I know the various railway platform wagons soldiered on, with some of the heavy ones making it into the 1980s in service for steel transport etc. But half-tracks might not have been as cost-effective to operate...
ReluctantRenegade
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Wien, Austria
Joined: March 09, 2016
KitMaker: 2,407 posts
AeroScale: 105 posts
Posted: Tuesday, October 13, 2020 - 12:00 AM UTC
The Czech Railways used two Bergepanters for heavy duty salvage operations well into the '60s. Their original Maybach engine was replaced by a V-2-34 of the T-34.






French Panter-crane:

varanusk
Staff MemberManaging Editor
ARMORAMA
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Santa Cruz de Tenerife, Spain / España
Joined: July 04, 2013
KitMaker: 1,287 posts
AeroScale: 4 posts
Posted: Tuesday, October 13, 2020 - 12:11 AM UTC
Yes, German vehicles were used as well. The latest Nuts&Bolts volume on the Famo has several photos of a Sd.Kfz 9/2 with its 10ton crane in use well after the war.
RobinNilsson
Staff MemberTOS Moderator
KITMAKER NETWORK
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Stockholm, Sweden
Joined: November 29, 2006
KitMaker: 6,687 posts
AeroScale: 21 posts
Posted: Tuesday, October 13, 2020 - 12:11 AM UTC
One Sd.Kfz. 11 halftrack that surrendered in northern Norway was given a hardtop cabin from some light/medium truck and was used when building electric power lines in northern Sweden.
A Panther chassis was used to carry a crane somewhere in France (I believe it was in France). The French army used Panther tanks for some years.

On this web-site: https://www.saar-nostalgie.de/Sonderfahrzeuge.htm
there is one grainy image of a halftrack used to collect garbage in Saarbrücken....
ReluctantRenegade
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Wien, Austria
Joined: March 09, 2016
KitMaker: 2,407 posts
AeroScale: 105 posts
Posted: Tuesday, October 13, 2020 - 12:20 AM UTC
The Hanomag SS/ST100 series was kept in production until 1951: http://www.armorama.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=SquawkBox&file=index&req=viewtopic&topic_id=265109&ord=&page=17
Biggles2
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Quebec, Canada
Joined: January 01, 2004
KitMaker: 7,600 posts
AeroScale: 121 posts
Posted: Tuesday, October 13, 2020 - 03:05 AM UTC
Some 40 - 50 Czech-built Hetzers were assembled post-war and delivered per an order to Switzerland. Kettenkrad's were used (both with or without front wheel) for forest management post-war. Modified Pz. lV's, and StuG lll G's were used by Syria against Israel in '67. Then there is the ubiquitous VW "Beetle"...
Frenchy
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Rhone, France
Joined: December 02, 2002
KitMaker: 12,718 posts
AeroScale: 12 posts
Posted: Tuesday, October 13, 2020 - 03:42 AM UTC
Postwar Sd.Kfz 9's :





In action (1957) :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kn6sZ8-EqWo

This Sd.Kfz 251 fitted with a girder hoist was used by the Göttingen Fire Brigade :



Hetzer + crane from Czechoslovakia :



H.P.

RLlockie
_VISITCOMMUNITY
United Kingdom
Joined: September 06, 2013
KitMaker: 1,112 posts
AeroScale: 21 posts
Posted: Tuesday, October 13, 2020 - 03:45 AM UTC
If you want armour, there was a unit in Denmark used for mine clearing. There are photos around.
griffontech
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Canada
Joined: November 21, 2007
KitMaker: 237 posts
AeroScale: 0 posts
Posted: Tuesday, October 13, 2020 - 04:20 AM UTC
I read that Kettenkrad's were used post war by power companies and others due to its mobility.

https://www.military-history.org/articles/wmd-the-kettenkrad.htm

mligthart
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Zuid-Holland, Netherlands
Joined: July 07, 2015
KitMaker: 46 posts
AeroScale: 0 posts
Posted: Tuesday, October 13, 2020 - 05:09 AM UTC
if you are interrested in the use of softskins postwar , including German, then these books are recommended:

http://www.frituurzorro.nl/resto/html/eng/frame.html

I have book 1 and 2 and think they are awesome....
pbennett
_VISITCOMMUNITY
United Kingdom
Joined: October 14, 2007
KitMaker: 464 posts
AeroScale: 15 posts
Posted: Tuesday, October 13, 2020 - 06:23 AM UTC
Thanks to you all for your speedy and most informative responses.
My reason for asking the question is that I have various small scale (1/72 and 1/76) German vehicle kits ... mainly half-tracks, and was wondering whether I could depict them in something other than the typical wartime role. As a continuation to the original query, would any of the heavy trailers (such as the one towed by the FAMO for tank recovery) have found their way into haulage work post-war?
Frenchy
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Rhone, France
Joined: December 02, 2002
KitMaker: 12,718 posts
AeroScale: 12 posts
Posted: Tuesday, October 13, 2020 - 07:20 AM UTC
Another Sd.Kfz 9/1 that belonged to the Hamburg fire brigade in the 50's


Here's a Sd.Ahn 116 (hauling a O&K crane) towed by a Faun ZR. Both belonged to a Danish contractor in the 50's :



H.P.
pbennett
_VISITCOMMUNITY
United Kingdom
Joined: October 14, 2007
KitMaker: 464 posts
AeroScale: 15 posts
Posted: Tuesday, October 13, 2020 - 11:27 AM UTC
Henri-Pierre,

Many thanks ... I had originally thought my idea would be a non-starter, but there certainly seems to be some inspiration here!

Paul
jasegreene
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Florida, United States
Joined: October 21, 2013
KitMaker: 751 posts
AeroScale: 0 posts
Posted: Tuesday, October 13, 2020 - 01:23 PM UTC
There is the site wwiiafterwwii.wordpress. It covers only one topic,the use of weapons and vehicles from World War II after the war.There is a great article there about German Panzers being used during the Six Day War also.
Bonaparte84
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Hessen, Germany
Joined: July 17, 2013
KitMaker: 338 posts
AeroScale: 0 posts
Posted: Tuesday, October 13, 2020 - 10:01 PM UTC
Thank you for sharing this link. Some amazing stuff on there...
Frenchy
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Rhone, France
Joined: December 02, 2002
KitMaker: 12,718 posts
AeroScale: 12 posts
Posted: Tuesday, October 13, 2020 - 11:00 PM UTC
Feurwehr half-tracks used by the Potsdam fire brigade :







There are several postwar "in action" pics of the Hamburg fire brigade Sd.Kfz 9/1 in this booklet :

https://epub.sub.uni-hamburg.de//epub/volltexte/2013/25289/pdf/Die_Ruestwagen_Kranwagen_und_Geraetewagen_der_Feuerwehr_Hamburg_von_1939_bis_heute.pdf

H.P.
mmeier
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Nordrhein-Westfalen, Germany
Joined: October 22, 2008
KitMaker: 1,280 posts
AeroScale: 3 posts
Posted: Wednesday, October 14, 2020 - 05:43 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Not sure about tracked things, but I suspect plenty of wheeled trucks were recycled post-war. I know the various railway platform wagons soldiered on, with some of the heavy ones making it into the 1980s in service for steel transport etc. But half-tracks might not have been as cost-effective to operate...



The railroad stock both the classic "8 horses or 40 soldiers" cargo cars (2-axel) and the flatbeds where used well into the 1970s and 80s (including tank transportation, Leo I is lighter than a Tiger)

As for vehicles like the Opel "Blitz" and other wheeled trucks - I would be astonished if they where NOT used. They are basically commercial vehicles, resonably robust and available. On a continent with damaged industries and resource scarcity NOT using them would be a massiv waste. The Opel Blitz (3to and 1.5to variants) was even produced post war until 1949 (Some in a Mercedes Benz Plant, sold as L701).
pbennett
_VISITCOMMUNITY
United Kingdom
Joined: October 14, 2007
KitMaker: 464 posts
AeroScale: 15 posts
Posted: Wednesday, October 14, 2020 - 06:14 AM UTC
Amazing that a single (rather random question) can lead to such a fascinating discussion. No doubt others (like me) will be giving a 'different take' on some of the WW2 German vehicle kits. Interesting to see the results.

Paul
Frenchy
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Rhone, France
Joined: December 02, 2002
KitMaker: 12,718 posts
AeroScale: 12 posts
Posted: Wednesday, October 14, 2020 - 08:34 AM UTC

Quoted Text

As for vehicles like the Opel "Blitz" and other wheeled trucks - I would be astonished if they where NOT used. They are basically commercial vehicles, resonably robust and available.



This 1942 Mercedes-Benz L3000 was still used by the German "Technisches Hilfswerk"(Federal Agency for Technical Relief) in 1962 :


and this 1942 ex-Wehrmacht TLF-16 on a Mercedes-Benz L3000 chassis was used in France (at the Bugatti plant in Molsheim) until...2007





H.P.
WilliamHarry
_VISITCOMMUNITY
United States
Joined: August 07, 2009
KitMaker: 29 posts
AeroScale: 0 posts
Posted: Friday, October 16, 2020 - 04:17 AM UTC
Also, please don't forget that several nations used the PzKpfw IV in their designed role as tanks, notably the Syrians in the Six-Day War.

Bill
JavierDeLuelmo
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Spain / España
Joined: February 29, 2016
KitMaker: 189 posts
AeroScale: 0 posts
Posted: Friday, October 16, 2020 - 05:40 AM UTC
Back in 2006 reworked the old Italeri Horch Kfz.15 into one used as factory hack at VEB Leuna-Werke in the DDR till the early 60s.



covkid
_VISITCOMMUNITY
United Kingdom
Joined: March 13, 2015
KitMaker: 251 posts
AeroScale: 29 posts
Posted: Sunday, October 18, 2020 - 04:34 PM UTC
Hi,

Excellent work Javier.

Regards jason
mmeier
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Nordrhein-Westfalen, Germany
Joined: October 22, 2008
KitMaker: 1,280 posts
AeroScale: 3 posts
Posted: Monday, October 19, 2020 - 08:38 PM UTC
Yes, THW, jokingly called Trinken-Helfen-Weitersaufen (Drink-Help-Continue Drinking) or Tausend Hilflose Wichte (1000 confused dwarfs) and other government and civil aid agencies in germany use vehicles until "breakdown". And why not, they do the job and the budget is better used elsewhere. The MAN "Langhauber" of the MAN 630 from the lat 1950s where still in use with the german army in 1988 in some jobs.

Same for company vehicles and equipment. Our "Werksfeuerwehr" (Company fire department) and the company gardener (Putting trees on a spoil dump, google Hopstener Halde) still used Merceded 404 that where ordered in the 1960s until at least 1998. As for say TS 8-8 fire pumps, I saw those used by local volunteer fire departments into the late 1990s.