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Topics from the Dreadnaught era to modern day.
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Mikasa 1902 with Pontos 1/200th.
RedDuster
_VISITCOMMUNITY
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: March 01, 2010
KitMaker: 6,330 posts
AeroScale: 118 posts
Posted: Friday, December 14, 2018 - 09:08 PM UTC

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Hi Si -
I've been a bit of a lurker lately - modeling mojo gone a little flat but it always returns . I have been following your builds for a bit now and want to compliment you on your workmanship and I , like many , am amazed at your prolific output.
Keep it up - fuel for inspiration.
Cheers - Richard




Hi Richard,

Thank you for your kind comments, I am glad you are enjoying what I am doing. I am a little more prolific than usual as currently I am working from home and that gives me an hour or two most evenings to sneak into the workshop and do a bit.


Glad to have you looking in, and please feel free to comment any time you like.

Cheers

Si
RedDuster
_VISITCOMMUNITY
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: March 01, 2010
KitMaker: 6,330 posts
AeroScale: 118 posts
Posted: Friday, December 14, 2018 - 09:32 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Si,
It'll be interesting seeing your plan come to fruition. The old ship was quite stout, eh? Quite a pronounced ram bow, too.

Gaz




Hi Gaz,

So will I, it is a bit organic. Like almost all aftermarket sets, the order of the kit and the Pontos instructions bear no relationship to each other, and neither of them bear any relationship to the order I do things in.


The pre-dreadnoughts were sturdy beasts for there size, and with those big guns on such a small hull made them look tough. I like the elegance of the ram bow, even though they were totally impractical at the time of this fine vessel.

Cheers

Si
JJ1973
#345
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Niedersachsen, Germany
Joined: August 22, 2011
KitMaker: 1,616 posts
AeroScale: 0 posts
Posted: Saturday, December 15, 2018 - 08:23 AM UTC
Si,

that's another very cool subject you chose! And another one I'm really happy that I don't have to serve on board....
Very nice start, and of course I'm in and following! Looking forward to one more special build of yours, mate!

Cheers,
Jan
GazzaS
#424
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Queensland, Australia
Joined: April 23, 2015
KitMaker: 3,979 posts
AeroScale: 1,768 posts
Posted: Saturday, December 15, 2018 - 09:36 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text

Si,
It'll be interesting seeing your plan come to fruition. The old ship was quite stout, eh? Quite a pronounced ram bow, too.

Gaz




Hi Gaz,

So will I, it is a bit organic. Like almost all aftermarket sets, the order of the kit and the Pontos instructions bear no relationship to each other, and neither of them bear any relationship to the order I do things in.


The pre-dreadnoughts were sturdy beasts for there size, and with those big guns on such a small hull made them look tough. I like the elegance of the ram bow, even though they were totally impractical at the time of this fine vessel.

Cheers

Si



I've been wanting to build Borodino or one of the other Russian pre-dreadnoughts. Finding one in 200 scale would be awesome.

Gaz
TimReynaga
Staff MemberAssociate Editor
MODEL SHIPWRIGHTS
_VISITCOMMUNITY
California, United States
Joined: May 03, 2006
KitMaker: 1,905 posts
AeroScale: 186 posts
Posted: Saturday, December 15, 2018 - 11:24 AM UTC

Quoted Text

...Quite a pronounced ram bow, too.



I wonder if the ram-like inverted bows of Mikasa and other ships this era were actually intended to serve as rams or were they predecessors of the later bulbous underwater bows intended to increase buoyancy and reduce water resistance?
RussellE
#306
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Victoria, Australia
Joined: June 27, 2010
KitMaker: 2,790 posts
AeroScale: 296 posts
Posted: Saturday, December 15, 2018 - 09:22 PM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text

...Quite a pronounced ram bow, too.



I wonder if the ram-like inverted bows of Mikasa and other ships this era were actually intended to serve as rams or were they predecessors of the later bulbous underwater bows intended to increase buoyancy and reduce water resistance?



Tim, I believe the ram like bows were still part of Admiralty belief that ramming was an acceptable tactic.

By WW2 ram bows had all but been abandoned, and only later on, as more hydro testing data became available, bulbous bows were incorporated
RedDuster
_VISITCOMMUNITY
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: March 01, 2010
KitMaker: 6,330 posts
AeroScale: 118 posts
Posted: Saturday, December 15, 2018 - 09:28 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Si,

that's another very cool subject you chose! And another one I'm really happy that I don't have to serve on board....
Very nice start, and of course I'm in and following! Looking forward to one more special build of yours, mate!

Cheers,
Jan




Thanks Jan,

Always glad to have you aboard mate. This is my first step into this scale, in theory this should be a little simpler than the WW2 era battlewagons. We shall have to see how it goes.

Cheers

Si
RedDuster
_VISITCOMMUNITY
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: March 01, 2010
KitMaker: 6,330 posts
AeroScale: 118 posts
Posted: Saturday, December 15, 2018 - 09:32 PM UTC

Quoted Text



I've been wanting to build Borodino or one of the other Russian pre-dreadnoughts. Finding one in 200 scale would be awesome.

Gaz




Unfortunately Gaz, Mikasa, albeit in two forms is the only game in town in this scale. 1/350th there are a fair few Russian pre-dreads both plastic & resin.


any other pre-dread in 1/200th would be fine by me.

Cheers, Si

RedDuster
_VISITCOMMUNITY
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: March 01, 2010
KitMaker: 6,330 posts
AeroScale: 118 posts
Posted: Saturday, December 15, 2018 - 10:42 PM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text


Quoted Text

...Quite a pronounced ram bow, too.



I wonder if the ram-like inverted bows of Mikasa and other ships this era were actually intended to serve as rams or were they predecessors of the later bulbous underwater bows intended to increase buoyancy and reduce water resistance?



Tim, I believe the ram like bows were still part of Admiralty belief that ramming was an acceptable tactic.

By WW2 ram bows had all but been abandoned, and only later on, as more hydro testing data became available, bulbous bows were incorporated



Hi Russ & Tim,

The Ram came back into fashion in the early Ironclads, which had few if any, guns capable of penetrating their opponent's armour and they had an appalling rate of fire. Ramming was used with varying success at The Battles of Hampton Roads, Lissa & Iquque in the third quarter of the 19th centaury. It's effectiveness was proved by the accidental ramming of the HMS Victoria by HMS Camperdown in 1893.

The ram was going out of fashion around the time the Mikasa was built, so this could be the "inverted bow" which was the precursor of the bulbous bow. The idea was to maintain the waterline length (the power needed to push a ship the water at any given speed is a function of speed / square root of the length on the waterline,) whilst having less deck exposed to the muzzle flash of the more powerful guns.

From the shape of this, I reckon it was designed to be used as a ram if the opportunity presented itself, whilst serving as an inverted bow.

Cheers

Si

RussellE
#306
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Victoria, Australia
Joined: June 27, 2010
KitMaker: 2,790 posts
AeroScale: 296 posts
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2018 - 08:55 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text


Quoted Text


Quoted Text

...Quite a pronounced ram bow, too.



I wonder if the ram-like inverted bows of Mikasa and other ships this era were actually intended to serve as rams or were they predecessors of the later bulbous underwater bows intended to increase buoyancy and reduce water resistance?



Tim, I believe the ram like bows were still part of Admiralty belief that ramming was an acceptable tactic.

By WW2 ram bows had all but been abandoned, and only later on, as more hydro testing data became available, bulbous bows were incorporated



Hi Russ & Tim,

The Ram came back into fashion in the early Ironclads, which had few if any, guns capable of penetrating their opponent's armour and they had an appalling rate of fire. Ramming was used with varying success at The Battles of Hampton Roads, Lissa & Iquque in the third quarter of the 19th centaury. It's effectiveness was proved by the accidental ramming of the HMS Victoria by HMS Camperdown in 1893.

The ram was going out of fashion around the time the Mikasa was built, so this could be the "inverted bow" which was the precursor of the bulbous bow. The idea was to maintain the waterline length (the power needed to push a ship the water at any given speed is a function of speed / square root of the length on the waterline,) whilst having less deck exposed to the muzzle flash of the more powerful guns.

From the shape of this, I reckon it was designed to be used as a ram if the opportunity presented itself, whilst serving as an inverted bow.

Cheers

Si




and now we have the Zumwalt class
RedDuster
_VISITCOMMUNITY
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: March 01, 2010
KitMaker: 6,330 posts
AeroScale: 118 posts
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2018 - 08:57 PM UTC

Quoted Text

and now we have the Zumwalt class



A ram wouldn't be a bad idea those ships, they do look a bit like a tall narrow version of a casemate ironclad from the 1860s / 70s.



Cheers

Si
RedDuster
_VISITCOMMUNITY
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: March 01, 2010
KitMaker: 6,330 posts
AeroScale: 118 posts
Posted: Monday, December 17, 2018 - 08:16 AM UTC
Sunday's progress

The seam filled and almost leaned up, not really that bad.



Propeller shafts fitted in place.



The seam cleaned up and the bilge keels fitted.



The kit 6" with the Pontos barrel for comparison, the actual barrel length should be 6.050 mtrs, which translated to just over 30mm, which makes the kit barrel overlong.



fitted, again with an original for comparison.



All 6" guns modified.



Port guns fitted, but not glued.



And the gunports fitted in the closed position. I have used the kit ports, as the Pontos ports have the actual barrel port for the barrel in the closed position on the three centre guns. One slight issue, the hinge points on centre section of each port do not line up with their mounting slots, not a major issue, just a little error.




the starboard guns in place. The starboard ports will be open, and fitted much later in the build.



Cheers

Si.
TimReynaga
Staff MemberAssociate Editor
MODEL SHIPWRIGHTS
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California, United States
Joined: May 03, 2006
KitMaker: 1,905 posts
AeroScale: 186 posts
Posted: Tuesday, December 18, 2018 - 02:40 AM UTC
Si,

Those turned brass guns are a big improvement! And that's a cool idea with the half open/half closed secondary guns - gives observers a reward for looking at both sides of the finished model.
Removed by original poster on 12/18/18 - 17:20:01 (GMT).
RedDuster
_VISITCOMMUNITY
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: March 01, 2010
KitMaker: 6,330 posts
AeroScale: 118 posts
Posted: Tuesday, December 18, 2018 - 05:19 AM UTC

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Quoted Text

Si,

Those turned brass guns are a big improvement! And that's a cool idea with the half open/half closed secondary guns - gives observers a reward for looking at both sides of the finished model.



They certainly are Tim, I would have hated to have to correct & re-drill all 14 kit barrels.

I did like the option have the ports open or closed, seemed a waste not to exercise both options, and as you say it adds some interest.

Thank-you for looking in and your kind comments.

Cheers

Si


Thanks

surfsup
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Queensland, Australia
Joined: May 20, 2010
KitMaker: 1,058 posts
AeroScale: 0 posts
Posted: Tuesday, December 18, 2018 - 10:54 AM UTC
Very nice start Si.....Cheers Mark
d6mst0
#453
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Texas, United States
Joined: August 28, 2016
KitMaker: 1,162 posts
AeroScale: 5 posts
Posted: Tuesday, December 18, 2018 - 12:07 PM UTC
Yes, those brass barrels really do make a difference. Looking sweet Si.

Mark
RedDuster
_VISITCOMMUNITY
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: March 01, 2010
KitMaker: 6,330 posts
AeroScale: 118 posts
Posted: Tuesday, December 18, 2018 - 08:51 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Very nice start Si.....Cheers Mark



Thanks Mark,

So far so good, apart from the slight hull seam, she is going together very well.


Cheers

Si
RussellE
#306
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Victoria, Australia
Joined: June 27, 2010
KitMaker: 2,790 posts
AeroScale: 296 posts
Posted: Tuesday, December 18, 2018 - 08:54 PM UTC
Those 6"brass barrels look so much better Si

Come on Master Model! We need the 9.2"s for the Lord Nelson Class!
RedDuster
_VISITCOMMUNITY
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: March 01, 2010
KitMaker: 6,330 posts
AeroScale: 118 posts
Posted: Tuesday, December 18, 2018 - 08:56 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Yes, those brass barrels really do make a difference. Looking sweet Si.

Mark



Thanks Mark,

They do, for kit barrels, what is supplied isn't too bad... Until you put it against a decent bit of brass, then it looks a bit second division (as well as being too long).


Cheers

Si
RedDuster
_VISITCOMMUNITY
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: March 01, 2010
KitMaker: 6,330 posts
AeroScale: 118 posts
Posted: Friday, December 21, 2018 - 09:53 AM UTC
This week's progress,

Pictures without words, except kit parts and brass going on the port bow.
















The brass parts are either replacements for moulded detail that was removed, or kit parts.

that's one quarter of it done.

more soon

Cheers

Si
GazzaS
#424
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Queensland, Australia
Joined: April 23, 2015
KitMaker: 3,979 posts
AeroScale: 1,768 posts
Posted: Friday, December 21, 2018 - 02:46 PM UTC
Nicely added, Si! Bigger scale require more bling!

Gaz
RedDuster
_VISITCOMMUNITY
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: March 01, 2010
KitMaker: 6,330 posts
AeroScale: 118 posts
Posted: Friday, December 21, 2018 - 09:23 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Nicely added, Si! Bigger scale require more bling!

Gaz



Thanks Gaz,

You are not wrong, and at least some of the etched parts are larger too! A great assistance to my tired old eyes.

Cheers

Si
Barrovian
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United Kingdom
Joined: July 16, 2014
KitMaker: 6 posts
AeroScale: 2 posts
Posted: Saturday, December 22, 2018 - 12:17 AM UTC
I have this kit, mainly out of nostalgia as is was built in my home town and Mikasa Street runs perpendicular to my childhood home.

I've never built up the courage to start this build but your build will give me an excellent point of reference.
RedDuster
_VISITCOMMUNITY
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: March 01, 2010
KitMaker: 6,330 posts
AeroScale: 118 posts
Posted: Saturday, December 22, 2018 - 06:59 AM UTC

Quoted Text

I have this kit, mainly out of nostalgia as is was built in my home town and Mikasa Street runs perpendicular to my childhood home.

I've never built up the courage to start this build but your build will give me an excellent point of reference.




Hi Gary,

Welcome aboard.

That is an interesting connection with the ship. The kit itself looks very good, and so far goes together pretty well. Please feel free to ask anything along the way.

Thanks you for looking in.

Cheers

Si