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World War II: Great Britain
Aircraft of Great Britain in WWII.
Hosted by Rowan Baylis
Advice requested on the Matchbox 1/32Lysander
165thspc
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Posted: Tuesday, January 09, 2018 - 12:31 AM UTC
I am new to the aircraft side of the Kitmaker network. (This and a Fiesler Storch are my first aircraft in over 50 years!) ANY info on upgrading the Matchbox 1/32 Westland Lysander would be very much appreciated - EVERYTHING in aviation modeling is new to me!

I have done what I think is a thorough search of the Kitmaker website and have found very little information on the title model.

Can anyone direct me to generic threads on upgrading this model especially regarding the building of your own control panels? I feel the stock Matchbox control panel is one place this kit is really lacking in detail! Also are there any AM generic gauge decals available in this scale?

Any/all info appreciated.

165thspc
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Posted: Tuesday, January 09, 2018 - 12:34 AM UTC
OK, I did recently find Airscale in the UK. Very interesting after market manufacture. They had everything I could hope for pertaining to instrument gauges short of having an actual brass etched Lysander instrument panel. (However they do have a number of other beautiful WWII complete instrument panels.)

My order for generic gauges, placards and instrument bezels has been placed!

Link to the Airscale home page:

http://www.airscale.co.uk/index.php#top
165thspc
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Posted: Tuesday, January 09, 2018 - 12:35 AM UTC
Current status on my Lysander
(As to the internal detailing, I am just following in the footsteps of other modelers I've seen who have gone before.)





Here are the internal cloth ribbing supports as added.

As you can see I already made at least one error: (Red Arrow) e.g. I cut open the exhaust outlet for the right side oil cooler. I trusted in where Matchbox had molded the indent on the outside body shell. In reality the indent shown on the model is approximately 20 scale inches too far back and if on the real aircraft it would foul the cockpit window mechanism if located there. Some filling and re-cutting will be required to fix this.

I plan on making my "Lizzie" a photo recon unit with one camera hard mounted vertically in the belly of the aircraft, The rear figure will be holding a second, larger aerial camera in his hands and shooting out through the open cockpit. (This was a very common practice throughout both wars.)
165thspc
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Posted: Tuesday, January 09, 2018 - 12:39 AM UTC


Before the recent Hollywood movie "Allied" I would have had no idea what a Lysander was. But as the aircraft was featured prominently in the movie my interest level has gone up about a thousand fold.

Again, any detailing information, advice or AM parts sources would be greatly appreciated. - I'm a newbie here!
165thspc
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Posted: Tuesday, January 09, 2018 - 12:59 AM UTC
Given my general interest in Combat Photography these photos inspired me to build my Lysander as a photo recon unit.





Below - Belly mounted camera. (Unknown aircraft.)
165thspc
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Posted: Tuesday, January 09, 2018 - 01:21 AM UTC
My research has been moving slowly on the Lysander but some items jumped out at me right away. Two immediate alterations were to open up the end of the main exterior exhaust pipe as well as opening the carburetor air scoop located directly below the engine in the cowl.



In addition I fabricated the ring shaped exhaust collector just inside the cowl and also added the two fresh air oil cooler intake pipes to the engine assembly.

The circular exhaust collector ring, front cowl sheet metal and the main exhaust pipe are all one built up, integral piece on the real aircraft, hence the burnt "hot metal" dark bronze color. That color was achieved by starting with a dull aluminum paint base coat to which I then "scrub-brushed" a dark red pastel chalk into. When finished, the pastel chalk was so burnished into the paint that it is no longer affected by touch and does not rub off.
rdt1953
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Posted: Tuesday, January 09, 2018 - 02:15 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Before the recent Hollywood movie "Allied" I would have had no idea what a Lysander was. But as it was featured somewhat prominently in the movie my interest level has gone up about a thousand fold.

Again, any detailing information, advice or AM parts sources would be greatly appreciated. - I'm a newbie here!



Hi Michael - you are doing a beautiful job on your Lizzie . Some where on this site Jesse posted pics of a restored Lysander in a Canadian Museum IIRC. The unusual thing about this aircraft is they left the covering off so much of the interior can be seen . I regret I can't get you a link to it but I will continue to look for it and will post on this thread if I find it. Perhaps another member may know where it is .

Keep up the great work - Richard
rdt1953
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Posted: Tuesday, January 09, 2018 - 02:22 AM UTC
Michael - found it but I can't link it . Go to Forums - World War II - currently on page 6 halfway down . Thread is titled " questions about Lysander Cockpits " started by maxmwill- hope this is of some use to you . - Richard
165thspc
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Posted: Tuesday, January 09, 2018 - 05:58 AM UTC
Richard it took some searching but I finally found the thread you were talking about. Thank you for the lead. Here is the link:

http://www.kitmaker.net/modules.php?op=modload&name=SquawkBox&file=index&req=viewtopic&topic_id=254068&page=1
165thspc
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Posted: Tuesday, January 09, 2018 - 06:05 AM UTC
Here are a couple of shots of the Lysander cockpit that I have found online:







165thspc
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Posted: Tuesday, January 09, 2018 - 09:14 AM UTC
Earlier I made mention of the variety of aerial cameras that were often handheld by Air Corps photographers. Here are but a few.




Life Magazine photographer Margaret "Peggy" Bourke-White, holding K-20 aerial camera. She flew a number of combat photographic missions in the ETO for the magazine. (Life Magazine Photo)


(Two photos just above - HistoryLink101.com)

The large size of these cameras is governed by the image quality required for aerial recon analysis. These cameras shot 5" x 20' roll film. This produced a 5"x7" sized negative.
165thspc
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Posted: Tuesday, January 09, 2018 - 11:44 PM UTC
Lizzie with her clothes off: (Cover your eyes!)


Note prone navigator figure on rear floor below gunners feet.
(Drawing from Flight Magazine, June 1935 - used here for discussion only.)









(All photos above used for discussion only.)
Longshanks8
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Posted: Wednesday, January 10, 2018 - 12:26 AM UTC
HTH

1/48 scale Hawk Lysander loads of detail......

http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/235001898-148-lysander-mk-ii-1960s-hawk-version-end-of-year-end-of-build-its-finished/&
165thspc
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Posted: Wednesday, January 10, 2018 - 01:07 AM UTC
Thank you Sir. That is a great build log you have introduced us to. It answers many question but also creates some as well. I am now slowly working my way through this highly detailed but lengthly how-to.
165thspc
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Posted: Wednesday, January 10, 2018 - 11:02 AM UTC
A little bit of basic work:

The Matchbox kit does have separate rudder, elevator and aileron surfaces but none of those included working hinges of any kind. It was fairly easy to add pivot pins to all these control surfaces to make them positionable.



I also restructured the flaps to set them at about 20%. The flaps and slats of the real Lysander were automatic. 20% flap will then also trigger the inboard set of leading edge slats which I intend to show in the deployed position.





Update Note: Just could not stand my wimpy efforts on rebuilding the flaps at a modest 20%. I am now in the process of rebuilding the wings yet AGAIN! When finished, the new flaps should be at near 95% which I feel is only appropriate for an aircraft such as the Lysander. New photos shortly.
165thspc
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Posted: Wednesday, January 10, 2018 - 11:16 AM UTC
A couple of small items:

I cut the throttle control out of that big, all-in-one piece panel in the Matchbox kit and added it to the airframe. I also knocked together a scratch built map case to add just forward of the throttle.




I thought I would go with leather upholstery for the Lysander. The finish was created by starting with a coat of Rust colored paint then covering it in Future Floor Wax.

p.s. I have seen a leather pilot's seat where the unpadded lower parachute "bucket" was also covered in leather.

165thspc
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Posted: Thursday, January 11, 2018 - 05:14 AM UTC
Interesting anecdote:

From:
pickledwings

One of my favorite WWII anecdotes came from a former RAF Lysander pilot. Apparently the lifting qualities of the Lysander wing were such that if you had a good wind, you could just point the plane into it, set the wing and elevator controls and bring the engine power up and the wind would do the rest so that the plane could get off the ground without any sort of take off role.
He told me about seeing a Harrier take off vertically and wondering what all the fuss was about “We were doing the same thing in Lysanders years before and using a lot less fuel in the process!”



This photo seems to illustrate the anecdote, like a sea gull floating nearly motionless as
it coasts effortlessly on the lift of a steady breeze.
165thspc
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Posted: Thursday, January 11, 2018 - 07:00 AM UTC
Not necessarily a great photo but it does show a whole lot more flap than before. As soon as the glue drys I will be adding some filler putty and things will get going.



As you can see below the Lysander had some serious flap capability given its' STOL design.

Flaps deployed.
(Photo from the collection of Duncan Michael)
165thspc
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Posted: Thursday, January 11, 2018 - 07:05 AM UTC
After Market items for a new cockpit control panel from Airscale arrived today:





165thspc
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Posted: Friday, January 12, 2018 - 04:41 PM UTC
Does anyone make a better after market self defense weapon for the Lysander? The Matchbox machine gun moulding is fairly lame.
rdt1953
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Posted: Friday, January 12, 2018 - 06:05 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Does anyone make a better after market self defense weapon for the Lysander? The Matchbox machine gun moulding is fairly lame.



I believe both Lewis and Brownings were used in the defensive position on the Lizzie.

Gaspatch offers 3 different Lewis guns in 1/32 - Mk I with different style heat sinks and a Mk II . Don't know which if any are applicable to your aircraft . They look to be drum fed and the guns in your photo are belt fed ( Brownings perhaps ?) but perhaps the receivers are the same and you can simply leave the drums off or it may be that the Lewis guns were all drum fed including those used on Lysanders.

Richard
165thspc
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Posted: Friday, January 12, 2018 - 10:39 PM UTC
Richard, again thanks. Gaspatch is a name I just encountered a few weeks ago. I was very impressed with the full aircraft models they offered but it never occurred to me they might offer individual weapons. WOW!

Cheers

(At the risk of speaking heresy; I would rather mount a somewhat incorrect but well detailed weapon than use the poorly detailed kit piece. The Gaspatch AM offerings look fantastic!)
165thspc
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Posted: Saturday, January 13, 2018 - 12:18 AM UTC
That last remark was stated because I assumed if buying from Gaspatch I would have to substitute some similar (but slightly different) WWI gun but I how see that the exactly correct gun (Vickers K) is available from this manufacture!

Gaspatch offering
165thspc
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Posted: Saturday, January 13, 2018 - 01:31 AM UTC
Snow days (stuck in the house) can still be busy days:

Built and installed both left and right engine oil coolers;


Built and installed neck wall upper bulkhead;


Built and installed forward pilot's control panel arch;


Revised and installed gunner's circuit breaker/electrical/radio??? panel;


165thspc
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Posted: Saturday, January 13, 2018 - 01:38 AM UTC
AND

Body work on extended flaps is just about complete and they are ready for the final coat of primer;


Inboard slats have now been cut out and are ready for rebuilding;