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Cold War (1950-1974)
Discuss the aircraft modeling subjects during the Cold War period.
1/72 Airfix EE Lightning double build!
magnusf
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Stockholm, Sweden
Joined: May 02, 2006
KitMaker: 1,523 posts
AeroScale: 1,481 posts
Posted: Wednesday, October 12, 2016 - 02:48 AM GMT+7
I need something to get my modelling moving again. And that something is, without doubt, the ultimate cold war warrior: the English Electric Lightning! Or rather two of them...

I picked up one each of the F.6 and the F.2A cheaply a few months ago and started them after the summer. Adding new ejection seats from Barracuda Cast, a set of resin wheels from the same company and a few sheets of Xtradecal decals added a bit to the cost but still no risk of breaking the bank !

The kits...

The F.2A is a "starter kit" with paints and brushes included and a fairly limited decal sheet (just one RAFG aircraft). Not that it matters since I have more decals than needed already !


The F.6 is the same kit with an addendum sprue for the overwing tanks, the armed fuselage tank front (doesn't it sound ominous, "armed fuselage tank") and Red Top missiles.

And this is as far as we have gotten yet:

The resin seats are a joy to paint!


Intake/cockpit assemblies. The internal seam can be a bit tricky to get rid of, I opted for gluing the halves together and then cutting them off perpendicular to the intake channel. This way I could get a seamless front end of the intake and the resulting seam from my saw cut is hidden further back and can only be spotted using a set of sharp eyes and a some kind of light source...



Magnus
Antilles
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Nordrhein-Westfalen, Germany
Joined: March 22, 2015
KitMaker: 375 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, October 12, 2016 - 08:27 AM GMT+7
Hej Magnus,

good to see you have begun a new promising project! The Lightning is a phantastic aircraft! Nice kick off with the ejection seats. I will keep following!

Oliver
KelticKnot
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Scotland, United Kingdom
Joined: May 11, 2015
KitMaker: 645 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, October 12, 2016 - 09:25 AM GMT+7
Magnus, looks to be an interesting dual build to follow along with. I'll definitely keep that intake trick in mind for the future; such an elegant solution to reaching those hard to sand areas.
RussellE
#306
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Victoria, Australia
Joined: June 27, 2010
KitMaker: 1,712 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, October 12, 2016 - 10:34 AM GMT+7
nice topic Magnus - following along with interest
litespeed
Staff MemberNews Reporter
AEROSCALE
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England - North West, United Kingdom
Joined: October 15, 2009
KitMaker: 1,488 posts
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Posted: Thursday, October 13, 2016 - 10:19 AM GMT+7
Excellent project Magnus. I will be following along with your double build with great interest.
tim
GazzaS
#424
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Queensland, Australia
Joined: April 23, 2015
KitMaker: 2,887 posts
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Posted: Thursday, October 13, 2016 - 05:48 PM GMT+7
Magnus,
A pleasure to see you again! Those seats look fantastic!

Gaz
Joel_W
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New York, United States
Joined: December 04, 2010
KitMaker: 7,763 posts
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Posted: Saturday, October 15, 2016 - 07:03 AM GMT+7
Magnus,
Welcome back to the wingy things forum. I for one have missed you, as well as your most interesting duel builds of late.
I'm officially signing on for your latest duel build. I've always had the British Lightning on my to be built lists for what seems like forever, but so far that's as close as I've come.

Your detail painting of both ejection seats is certainly up to your current standards. The belts and harnesses are shaded perfectly.

Joel
magnusf
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Stockholm, Sweden
Joined: May 02, 2006
KitMaker: 1,523 posts
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Posted: Saturday, October 15, 2016 - 06:31 PM GMT+7
Friends! Thanks for the warm "welcome back", I appreciate it :-) !

Joel! (You're of course included in the "Friends" above but your comment merits a further answer :-) )... I think that figure painting course that took up most of my modelling time during late winter and spring taught me quite a lot of stuff that comes in handy for all kinds of modelling. Light and shadow and daring to go a bit "impressionistic" to compensate for size (or lack thereof) was one good lesson among others!

Not the world's most interesting update tonight, more kind of a "modellers beware"-thing:

Even if this is a nice kit that is well within the abilities of any modeller it is still not Tamiya. Getting the fuselage together well is a bit difficult.



Magnus
Joel_W
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New York, United States
Joined: December 04, 2010
KitMaker: 7,763 posts
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Posted: Sunday, October 16, 2016 - 02:12 AM GMT+7
Magnus,
I just might look into some of the basics for figure painting, as my efforts within a interior, especially bang seats, leave a lot to be desired. The trouble is I already don't have enough time for modeling and my other hobby, photography.

I certainly sense your frustration with getting fuselage halves to align properly. I've had my fair share of them over the last few years.

Joel
JClapp
#259
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Massachusetts, United States
Joined: October 23, 2011
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Posted: Sunday, October 16, 2016 - 08:50 AM GMT+7
I will follow your build too. Very interesting subject, not a "pretty" aircraft but a distinctive one !
magnusf
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Stockholm, Sweden
Joined: May 02, 2006
KitMaker: 1,523 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, October 19, 2016 - 02:28 AM GMT+7
Joel! To be honest, I think you're doing just fine and even more ! But it can of course still be interesting to explore new techniques. That lack of time is something I recognise very well by the way...

Jonathan! That just about mirrors my own feelings for this aircraft: not a looker but certainly interesting. Attraction might also have something to do with the total lack of compromise: speed and climbing ability. Period!

Now I have my own private QRA-shed:

Wings don't fit perfectly either. There is a distinct better fit on one side than on the other and both kits are exactly the same. I toyed with the idea of painting wings and fuselage separately but after a lot of pondering I decided against it. And that was probably the correct decision!



Magnus
KelticKnot
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Scotland, United Kingdom
Joined: May 11, 2015
KitMaker: 645 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, October 19, 2016 - 02:58 AM GMT+7
Shame about that wing fit but it wont be any trouble for you I'm sure.

Function over form certainly sums up the EE Lightning, although I have a soft spot for those cold war clunky lookin' jets.
Those over-wing tanks though, there must have been good reasons for them but they are so unusual (maybe unique?, I don't know) that they just look wrong!
phantom_phanatic309
#372
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United Kingdom
Joined: March 10, 2010
KitMaker: 1,872 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, October 19, 2016 - 05:06 AM GMT+7

Quoted Text

Shame about that wing fit but it wont be any trouble for you I'm sure.

Function over form certainly sums up the EE Lightning, although I have a soft spot for those cold war clunky lookin' jets.
Those over-wing tanks though, there must have been good reasons for them but they are so unusual (maybe unique?, I don't know) that they just look wrong!



Usually fitted for ferry flights along with the IFR probe. The range of the Lightning was abysmal even for the standards of the day, so anything to help was used. They wouldn't have been carried on QRA because of the drag penalty.
Once talked to a former Lighting fitter who told me first hand how awful the endurance was and how much a nightmare they were to maintain. 24 hours for every hour flying, which only got worse as the airframes aged. He described the Lightning as 'all flash and no bang' and would have been next to useless in a real war. Now while I will be the first to agree that his opinion is almost certainly coloured by a few bad experiences, it makes for an interesting difference of opinion.

Magnus, your builds are coming on really well and will look great once finished.
magnusf
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Stockholm, Sweden
Joined: May 02, 2006
KitMaker: 1,523 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, October 19, 2016 - 06:19 AM GMT+7
Stephen! That story is probably not too far from the truth... The aircraft of this generation (except maybe for the Phantom, which probably can be said to be half a generation younger as well...) aged incredibly fast. In Sweden we toiled on with the Draken until 1998, I wonder about the battle value of that one against a MiG-29 or an Su-27 that would have been a viable opponent from at least the mid-80's... One fun and positive fact about the Lightning though is that it was fairly safe: many were lost but remarkably few pilots lost their lives!

Paul! Aerodynamically I think the overwing position for the tanks is less than ideal but considering how the landing gear was designed there was simply no place below the wings for them (and for nothing else either, 2 missiles and for several marks no guns wasn't a lot of armament really...). For some reason, most aircraft lost the plumbing for those tanks in the late 70's and if I remember correctly what I've read, six aircraft got it back in the eighties.

I won't use the tanks since I'm going to do the last Lightning lost during RAF operations (there was tragic fatal accident in SA a few years ago with one of the civilian ex-RAF Lightnings flying there), covered by Ian Black in "The last of the Lightnings" where his No. 2 (an RAAF exchange pilot) had to leave XR769 after an onboard fire. There are several photos of the aircraft on its last sortie and it didn't carry these.

Regarding overwing stuff, the only other common aircraft I can think about is the Jaguar, both the French and the RAF machines used overwing pylons for missiles and jamming pods!



Magnus
phantom_phanatic309
#372
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United Kingdom
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Posted: Wednesday, October 19, 2016 - 06:32 AM GMT+7
The JL100 MATRA/fuel tank rocket pod was offered as a ground attack weapon for the F.6. I think Saudi and Kuwaiti aircraft might have used those operationally.
Might make for something a bit different.
magnusf
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Stockholm, Sweden
Joined: May 02, 2006
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Posted: Wednesday, October 19, 2016 - 06:43 AM GMT+7
The JL-100 tank/rocket combo is what I call a real party-kit !



Magnus
GazzaS
#424
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Queensland, Australia
Joined: April 23, 2015
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Posted: Wednesday, October 19, 2016 - 09:12 AM GMT+7
Magnus,
I don't know much about the EE Lightning. But it is a cool looking plane in my opinion. When you look at it, you see speed.

I'm looking forward to the finishes you put on these twins.

Gaz
Joel_W
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New York, United States
Joined: December 04, 2010
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Posted: Wednesday, October 19, 2016 - 09:18 AM GMT+7
Magnus,
You're really moving along quite quickly, and in short order you'll be painting both aircraft. I keep on looking at the artist's drawing of the F.2A, with it's weathering, and it does look rather accurate to what we're trying to achieve with Black Basing as a start to the process.

Are you planning on a similar camo paint scheme and weathering? And how about the F.6? Will you be going NMF as on it's box top?
Joel
magnusf
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Stockholm, Sweden
Joined: May 02, 2006
KitMaker: 1,523 posts
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Posted: Saturday, October 29, 2016 - 09:25 AM GMT+7
Gary and Joel! We are three friends doing Lightnings so I don't have total freedom when it comes to picking a paint scheme. My lot is an NMF F2.A from RAFG and a green/grey camouflaged F.6. I'm looking forward to trying out the new Vallejo metal acrylics, experiments look promising but you never know for sure until using them on the real thing!


I've been wrestling the canopies in place and filling in around the windscreens. Not my favourite part of the job but now it's done! Masks are from Eduard (my favourite modelling cheat...).

Have a nice weekend!



Magnus
Joel_W
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New York, United States
Joined: December 04, 2010
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Posted: Saturday, October 29, 2016 - 10:16 AM GMT+7
Magnus,
both Lightnings are looking quite good. Like you, Eduard masks are my only must have AM purchase per kit. The last hand masking I did was on the GWH P-61! A true nightmare in every sense of the word.
Joel
magnusf
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Stockholm, Sweden
Joined: May 02, 2006
KitMaker: 1,523 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, November 29, 2016 - 08:41 PM GMT+7
Joel! Sorry for being impolite and not answering but I'm still chocked by your choice of your last choice of kit to hand-mask: a P-61??? The only thing worse that I can think about would be one of the WWII German bombers like the Ju-88 och He-111...

Almost a month since last update, lots of work and a visit to Scale Modelworld are the main reasons for that. At least Scale Modelworld was worth it !




I realised that the surface finish wasn't up to scratch (pun intended) as a base for NMF so I did a bit of experimenting on my old Tempest paint test victim. I finally settled for Games Workshop Chaos Black as a primer. It doesn't dry glossy but it dries hard and it can be polished afterwards using Micro Mesh sanding pads (bought them at SMW by the way ). Another alternative was using Tamiya gloss black from a spray can but ut doesn't set as hard as the GW primer and it also seems to be a bit "hotter" than GW, potentially attacking the plastic if one isn't careful.



Magnus
magnusf
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Stockholm, Sweden
Joined: May 02, 2006
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Posted: Wednesday, November 30, 2016 - 12:07 AM GMT+7
This is what I call progress, two posts on the same day!




This is Vallejo "Chrome", all photos I've seen of the natural metal Lightnings show them very shiny so I'll start with this as a base, adding panels with some of the other shades in the range.



Magnus
spaarndammer
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Noord-Holland, Netherlands
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Posted: Wednesday, November 30, 2016 - 12:46 AM GMT+7
Looks very shiny Magnus! Nice!



Jelger
Joel_W
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New York, United States
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Posted: Wednesday, November 30, 2016 - 06:42 AM GMT+7
Magnus,
Most impressive progress for sure. the NMF chrome really is quite shiny.

Black basing for a NMF has become a subjective rather then a objective subject lately. I use to try for a super shiny gloss black finish, and always had less then decent results. Then I was using Tamiya Gray primer under the Gloss Black as it needed something to bite into. Then polishing it to various levels of success. finally, the light bulb turned on

Why two steps when one will do. I now prime with MIG AMM Acrylic black primer thinned 1:1 with Tamiya Yellow cap. Goes down smooth as silk. It's not shiny, but it's the smoothness that really counts. The Alcad2 Metalizers I use look exceeding good, and while not super shiny, look like Aluminum with a slight operational dullness to them.

Joel
litespeed
Staff MemberNews Reporter
AEROSCALE
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England - North West, United Kingdom
Joined: October 15, 2009
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Posted: Wednesday, November 30, 2016 - 08:30 AM GMT+7

Quoted Text

This is what I call progress, two posts on the same day



That is great progress Magnus and illustrates the beauty of modern paints. They dry so fast allowing for dramatic progress. The Vallejo Chrome looks very good and it appears consistent. Will you need to seal it? It will be interesting to see how you progress with the finish Magnus.
tim